200. From Fairytale to Divorce to Real Love with Armony Mangin

What if you could hit the reset button after personal heartbreak and discover a whole new world of self-discovery, resilience, and love? On this episode, my inspiring guest, Armony Mangin takes us through her incredible journey - from surviving a 7.2 earthquake in Haiti and crossing hostile checkpoints, to combating depression, parental burnout, and the emotional fallout of divorce. 

While going through divorce, Armony promised herself one thing: she would not let a non functioning relationship define her next romantic relationships. Armony shares on how she got on social media for the first time 1 year after divorce, after having spent 9 months working on her relationship with herself, not having any dating life at all. 2 months in, she found her incredible man and went exclusive with him after about 2 months. 

Armony shares some of the tools she used in this journey (including Sade's 5 day webinar, the 50 green flag checklist episodes from the Dating After Divorce Podcast) to intentionally design her own dating with intention plan.  Through the process, Armony continually reminded herself that it was fun and was the best opportunity to learn more about herself and what she valued and wanted in her life.

Featured on the Show: Armony Margin

• Armony’s Website
• Armony’s Linktree

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Transcript

Sade Curry: 0:30

Right. Hello everyone, welcome back to the dating after divorce podcast. I have here on Zoom with me my fellow coach colleague, Armony Mangin, and she is here to tell her dating after divorce story. So Armony is a humanitarian turned life coach and she has like a really fascinating life story. I haven't heard a lot of it so I'm going to have my own live responses to it, but Armony has survived a 7.2 earthquake in Haiti, she has had to cross checkpoints held by child soldiers, she's lived a fairy tale love story, experienced parental burnout, depression and divorce, and now she's here to talk about her present day, where she's learned to enjoy the contrasts of the life journey. Armony is so glad to have you. Welcome, welcome, welcome.

Armony Mangin: 1:21

Thanks, Sade, and I am so thrilled to be here because, when you are, you invited me. Actually, I did not hesitate a second and in my head it was like a big yes. Let me help pass the message to other divorced women that dating on the apps is fun and that it's an amazing opportunity to get to know yourself on a deeper level. That was the thing that I was like do you want to be on my podcast? I was like, yes, yes.

Sade Curry: 1:46

Yes, so good.

Armony Mangin: 1:48

So tell us a little bit about you.

Sade Curry: 1:49

You said you're, yeah, you're ready to turn left. But tell us a little bit about that, like what you do, how you got there.

Armony Mangin: 1:55

So I'm a life coach right now and I have women who are at a major crossroads to redesign their life one decision at a time. I'm a decision coach, so with me it's like decision day every single day. I'm a parent today of two amazing kids, have two sons to boys they are seven and four and also work for an international medical organization, in communications and as a coach. Now, since I've got certified as a life coach, I used to be a humanitarian professional. I worked for international organizations and the United Nations in war zone countries and places affected by natural disasters, and so I did a master's degree to do that. I wanted to become a professional humanitarian worker. I studied very young. I turned 23 in Kabul. It was my first mission. I was 15.

Armony Mangin: 2:50

After about 10 years, eight years into that life, after spending most of my 20s traveling the world and helping other people in distress, I decided I wanted to get a position in a more stable place and I landed in New York City, and I have to say that that was way above what I had imagined could be possible for me. I was like, oh, I could get a job in New York City and I did, and three weeks into my new life in New York City. I was like, let me discover the city. I'm here for me, there's not going to be any guy involved. I was 30 years old and I had given myself three years and then I was like, okay, I'm going to be back to whatever I want to do, I'm going to be back to the city because with a non-profit salary, I'm not going to have the lifestyle that I want to have and build a family that I want to start. So I was like, let me just enjoy for three years a peaceful, stable lifestyle, which would be very different from, like, living in Kabul, new York City, kabul.

Armony Mangin: 3:53

And then I went into my new life. I met my now ex-susband. We got pregnant very quickly, like six weeks, which wasn't expected, but we took it as a beautiful thing and a big opportunity. We got married five months after we met, so we had our first kid. We had not been together for a year. And then we had a second kid three years after. And, one things after the other, and the pandemic, we started separating last February 2022. And so I live in Manhattan and I've been separated, divorced, for a year and a half now.

Sade Curry: 4:31

Yeah. So I mean, like you had that whirlwind relationship three weeks, like looking back, I mean and I know for many, for many of us, it's like when you look back at the relationship it's like do you see it now as a gift that just had its season end? Do you see it as, oh, like that was kind of an error and I shouldn't have done that? Like, what is your perspective on that first marriage?

Armony Mangin: 4:57

When I talk about it, I like to say I would do it all over again in a minute. I did the best that I could at that time. I was very happy, I was very confident I would have had that kid on my own anyways. I had the plan to go back to France and like find I could have done the same job that I was doing in New York, but from Paris, like I had a whole plan. But it turns out he was really happy, we were in love and then we made it work. So it's just it's. And actually this is exactly what I wanted, because before that I went into many relationships with many like short term, medium term, long term, all sorts of relationships with men from different background, culture, everything, and I knew I wanted to do something where we would go like 100% in right away fruit trust.

Armony Mangin: 5:44

So it just happened the way I was putting in the back of my mind but was always there. I wanted that thing. That didn't have to be complicated. It didn't have to be. We have to date, we have to get married and we have to have children. I was open to that because my life was like a crazy life. Going through all those places I was like, it's okay, I can make that work. So I would do that again. But also, as life brings his joys and happiness, it was. It also brought other issues because I think, going so fast into the process, we didn't build the foundation of our relationship. And when he got hard, I was like, of course, let's make it work, it's okay, just a little bum, like there's nothing wrong here. I know how I felt for you before, so I know I can create this, this again. But he was not at that point and he never walked out. So I was like, yeah, we know the response. I'm divorced today, but I would do it all over again.

Sade Curry: 6:41

Yeah, I love that and I just and then I love that you tied it into the fact that you'd seen so much in your life war torn countries, disasters, like all of these places. There's something I think about being so close to how fragile life is that helps you embrace life to the full, and that's sort of what I'm hearing in your stories that you were like yeah, I'm living in the present, I'm living in the moment, this is what I want right now and I'm willing to jump in and I'm willing to make it work when it gets hard.

Armony Mangin: 7:15

Yeah.

Sade Curry: 7:16

You know, of course, defining hard. And just a caveat for the listeners when we say hard in marriage, we don't mean an abusive or violent marriage, that's not the kind of thing we want to make work but like there's disconnect in the relationship or communication issues you can work at, at some of those things. So I just love that, I, because I think going on the apps is kind of like that, where sometimes when we're talking to women and they're like, well, they're dangerous people on the apps and I want to be careful and I'm like, well, you know, like every day you get in your car, right, and I have some, it's one of the most dangerous places to be is in a car on the highway anywhere in the world. And so sometimes our brains don't have this accurate view of what's dangerous and what isn't dangerous, or what's neutral versus what's a high stakes situation. And I think it sounds like you brought that background of like listen, guys, life is short, let's do it to your relationship.

Armony Mangin: 8:15

Yeah, and I remember even going through couple therapy. I was like I'm going to be thriving with you without you, but I might as well do it with you. But we know the response was no. So that's what's really and this is the way I went into dating. But it didn't happen like this, especially on the app, because before meeting him I always met my partners organically. Then we met on the street going to the same party in the lower East side, downtown Manhattan. It was raining, was kind of like, and then so that's not even a social media.

Armony Mangin: 8:44

I got on Instagram for the first time because I wanted to get on a fancy app that's called Raya and I had to be on Instagram. But I never was accepted in that app anyways. So I went on two different ones, but first I was like no way, I'm not going to do that. And then I tried a few things. I tried meeting people through friends because I declared to the world I was now ready to date again. I did a new beginnings party with my friends and I, like I told them I was alive coach. Now I told them I was ready, I was launching my business and I was ready to meet my incredible man. And then I had a whole list of all the things I was looking for and they were like, yeah, sure, good luck with that. I'm like, yeah, well, you see, I'm going to find him. But then I met.

Armony Mangin: 9:28

I studied meeting guys through people. Friends were like, oh, I know this guy, etc. Didn't work out. I also try really hard to make connections with anyone was like, hey, why not in my new building, in my work? Like I was very like, I'm here and I'm trying to make connections and I'm looking for my next boyfriend. And then this was very slow and I was like, okay, maybe this you're gonna have to get on the apps and actually got coached on that. And the thing that got me into it with that energy that you were talking about like let's make it work. We're not choosing against ourselves, but like let's use it as an additional tool is that I came up with like yeah, my man is out there looking out for me, so I might as well find him in the middle halfway through, which, for me, was the app.

Armony Mangin: 10:22

Yeah, yeah, I read it through you Like, but like all the other power sentences that got me into dating on the app, so like things, I kind of a mix of everything I heard and I was like I made in mind that I was like he's out there. I know I can't say my incredible man is out there, so you might as well just helping find you to right.

Sade Curry: 12:01

the way I have said something similar to that is like make it easy on him Right. Make it easy on him to find you. Like, don't hide in your apartment, yeah.

Armony Mangin: 12:12

I'm wondering why I don't have a boyfriend and I'm watching Netflix.

Sade Curry: 12:16

Yeah, if your incredible man is out there and he's hoping for a wonderful woman with certain qualities and you have those qualities just have mercy on him and put yourself where he can find you. If he's trying to find you, make it easy on him. Go to the parties, ask your friends to introduce you. Go to local events, join the community events. Go on the apps and make it easy that if he did decide okay, today's the day, I'm just going to check out what's on the apps it could end up being kind of like how my husband found me. He was only on the apps for two days and I showed up. It was just kind of that was nice for him.

Sade Curry: 12:54

I was on the apps for 18 months but it was easy for him to find me because I was right there. So, yeah, I love that you say that. I mean it really comes down to that belief that your man was out there, even though you hadn't seen him. You tried a bunch of things and the evidence wasn't there that he was there, but you believed that he was.

Armony Mangin: 13:13

Yeah and despite, or thanks, or I don't know how to put it, but like I just had gone through divorce. But even when I was divorcing I remember I was thinking don't let that divorce define your next relationships. Don't let it be the story of your life Like there's something bigger and better out there. And don't get me wrong, there were very low days and hard days and a lot of crying and very sad moments. But I had that and among the agitation I always had that voice inside of it. Just don't let it define the rest of your life. And then, from that being ready to date and then finally going on the dating apps and then when you get on the dating apps.

Armony Mangin: 14:01

It was like okay, so show me your profile, I'm gonna tell you what to do or not. I'm like no, I know who I am, I have experience, I know exactly what to put there, because I'm not gonna try to be someone else.

Sade Curry: 14:17

What were your thoughts? Going on Cause. You tried other things.

Armony Mangin: 14:21

And.

Sade Curry: 14:21

I actually wanted to pause for a minute because you talked about the app. Ryan which is really an app for celebrities, so it's kind of like a celebrity app. Yeah, but I was not accepted, I know, but I loved that you tried it. I loved that because I've kind of researched the apps.

Armony Mangin: 14:36

But I find you were on it so I'm like I can do it if they do it.

Sade Curry: 14:41

Yeah, yes, but I loved that you went on there, because it's so easy for us to disqualify ourselves, like if you applied, I'm not saying you want to accept it, but you applied you were like, well, they may not accept me, but I'm not gonna disqualify myself.

Armony Mangin: 14:56

And I have to tell you, though, to be honest, I would like full on into the dating. I took this like as my second. I had a full type job and I was launching the life coach business, but I took this. I was a very serious work thing. It was like 20 minutes per day.

Armony Mangin: 15:13

But, after divorce and moving out and going through like I really stayed single by myself for like nine full months and I think it takes a lot of courage to intentionally stay with your emotion, your sadness and the healing process and not befriend or try to get and like meet people and doing things. That was I really needed to do that and what got me also. Oh, they're like, I'm just gonna do it and I'm worthy and I'm a hundred percent worthy and lovable and I know it is obviously myself working on that. But also why going through divorce? When my ex-husband told me, okay, I can't do that anymore, we're gonna separate? It was last February. I was a couple of months into that. Sorry, I'm losing that.

Armony Mangin: 15:58

I actually met a guy in my building. He was much younger than me. He really went for me on the hunt and we had a very short story three months and with that man I made myself feel loved, desired, like I just it was a rebirth and I had forgotten all of that and I'm like, oh my God, it was like a young, super successful, super hot and I was like if. And I remember him telling me like when I saw you for the first time, I texted everybody in my group, my friends, like I just saw the most beautiful mom ever and then we had that beautiful short-term story three months.

Armony Mangin: 16:39

But I will always keep him really close to my heart because this is the reason why I was like okay, I know it's not him, I know I made myself feel like this, but really I was like hey, if this happened so easily with such an incredible man, there must be someone out there. And yes, he goes all the things, because he actually told that to me and he made me feel this way. So that was really helpful too. I'm not saying I wouldn't have done it, but I have to acknowledge that even those short stories would don't end up the way you want it to. You have to complete them Instead of taking them against yourself, like why was to be taken there?

Sade Curry: 17:17

to like to like take you to the next level, and that was really helpful. I love that so much. You've articulated something that I don't think I've talked about this on the podcast at all, but it's something that I definitely walk some of my clients through in my program, where they're on the app, so they're dating and then they meet. Like the first foundation we always set is always like let's stop meeting the low effort, non-committer, non-compatible man. We sweep them all out of the way. Then you start meeting the good men and, of course, not every good man is gonna be right for you. So they're going on these days with good men, they're enjoying these dates and they end up not being the guy. So maybe it's like two weeks with this person, three weeks, four dates, and then they realize, oh, this person didn't want kids or this person has this other thing and, like you said, sometimes it's so easy to use it against yourself. So you're meeting great guys, but maybe they're not wanting a commitment or you are not. There's something missing and you don't want them. And instead of saying, oh, my goodness, this person gave me the gift of showing me that what I want exists in the world. This person gave me the gift of this energetic excitement that I shared with him on two dates. And this person gave me that gift and I'm always trying to teach them, okay, cause it's kind of hard to articulate the embodiment of that, but it's like no, you're taking these little pieces of the puzzle from all of these people that you're meeting.

Sade Curry: 18:39

If someone like there was a client that didn't realize she wanted someone who was playful, that wasn't on her list, but then she experienced this guy on a couple of dates, super playful, there was just great energy.

Sade Curry: 18:51

And then I forget the reason why it didn't work out. But she was like, oh, I want that and I didn't know I wanted that. And I said, yeah, he came for those two dates just to show you that experience so that you could put it on your list and make sure that whoever you chose in the end had that energy included. So you didn't settle and so I love that you phrased that really short three month relationship as a gift and part of the journey and part of the healing, because, especially for if you're 40 plus and you've been married a long time, you may not have interacted with that many men in your lifetime like on a personal basis, and so there are pieces of the puzzle that can be missing, there's some ingredients that can be missing, so like if you eat a cake that was made without eggs and that's what you've eaten your whole life, and then one day somebody makes a cake that's super fluffy because there was egg in there, you're like wait this is what I'm gonna do going forward.

Armony Mangin: 19:49

Yeah, and this was so powerful that the first day he asked me so are you done with marriage? And because there was a connection, it was really working well. Also, that relationship made me realize, because I had not thought about that he had been two months, I was in the midst of it and I was like I told him, I had that voice again inside of me, very calm and very confident and so strong. I remember even feeling a warm feeling. I was like, oh no, I still do believe in marriage, like I still think that that equitable parenting relationship that I was craving for in my marriage but I didn't have it didn't happen.

Armony Mangin: 20:24

This time it was not the right person for me. He still is out there for me. And then he asked me and what about kids? And I was like, well, actually, yes, I do, I am absolutely open to have another kid. And so, through wing to the dates, I realized all of that. So that was, yeah, it's just like just go and take whatever you have to take, even though it doesn't end up the way you thought it would.

Sade Curry: 20:50

Yeah, yeah, amazing, All right. So I know we wanted to really hone in on your experience on the apps and kind of like them, your thoughts going in how you navigated the apps and how you met your current partner. So I'm just gonna let you just lay that whole story out.

Armony Mangin: 21:09

Yeah, where to start with, I told you I walked really hard. I like to say I walked really hard on meeting him. On hinge, hinge was my favorite. I tried three. I got into hinge and the league. The league was too slow for me. After a month I gave up. I was not really paying attention. I really loved hinge from the beginning, with like the prompts and the pictures I got. So, yeah, and I was like doing it was like 20 minutes per day. My profile was really clear. I had two kids. I had a picture with them at the end you didn't see their faces and I was looking for a long-term relationship. Yeah, and I was delegating about 15 to 20 minutes every day checking the profiles and then if there were matches and like conversation that I liked, like giving myself time or minutes and then following up every day. And then I participated to one of your webinars also and I remember also the questions. Do you remember the questions Like so?

Sade Curry: 22:12

I was like yeah the texting, yeah the texting. What to ask it?

Armony Mangin: 22:16

was really clear about the family was the one that were expecting their work, what they were doing, et cetera, and I had never an issue into like saying, hey, let's meet. Also, it would be both I would say let's meet, or they would say well, let's meet. And I had all the type of guys the one who, like well, I text, sing a lot and then when you to meet and then you say yes and then they don't answer anymore.

Armony Mangin: 22:40

The ones who like give you them your address right away, like big influencers. They know they were like people and I'm like no way. I thought the interesting thing is that the only person the people I met in person were the guys who initiated the conversation, talking about my kids or being a parent. So that was something I noticed. Actually, this was because, most of because a lot of them you talk, then you don't meet. It happens a lot, but I never took it against like use that against myself or didn't mean anything about me. I was like okay.

Sade Curry: 23:18

Yeah, let's pause for a minute on that, because that is such a big thing for women. Like they will be on the apps and a guy goes, so he doesn't show up, he doesn't meet, and then they think they're doing something or whether something wrong with them. Tell me, like, what were your thoughts when a guy didn't show up or any of these really annoying or frustrating things would happen? What were your thoughts about those things?

Armony Mangin: 23:41

So I never had a guy not showing up, but I had a lot of like talking let's meet, and then yes, and then nothing happens, and then they don't answer back. So after a few days I would remove them from my profile. I think I was just I knew this would happen. I think I heard it. Then I think what I was thinking is like I would imagine me doing that. What would I have been thinking and what would I have been going through to be doing that? Then what was coming to my mind was either they're here but not really intentional, because let's talk about the apps Everybody's on the apps for love. Nobody wants to talk about love. I was so funny.

Sade Curry: 24:23

I'm like tip-tarring around.

Armony Mangin: 24:25

It's like there's not a lot of people who are going on the apps with intentions, but they are.

Sade Curry: 24:30

Some are not.

Armony Mangin: 24:32

I mean, we have not all gone through all of this experience and knowing what we want. Especially, I wanted someone younger than me. I'm going to turn 39 next month and my rent was like 30 to 35. I put myself in a situation where maybe I had guys who were like, yeah, but not really knowing, just thinking if I would do that I wouldn't be like my mindset, I wouldn't like the person I am, I wouldn't, that's not someone I would want to be with.

Sade Curry: 25:01

Actually, I want to be with someone who answers, so they don't answer.

Armony Mangin: 25:05

It's too bad for them, it's just yeah.

Sade Curry: 25:09

What I'm hearing is that you centered your needs and what you wanted in the situation. So if someone did something you didn't want, you just allowed them to be who they were, instead of maybe trying to force them to do things. You're just like oh, this is what you do, this is not what I'm looking for, I'm just going to let you go. Yeah, exactly, amazing.

Armony Mangin: 25:30

Amazing and actually, and then, when I finally so, I met a couple, not so many people, until I met my boyfriend, which I'm going to refer to as hot dad, because every it's all my debts. I was putting them names, so I had Zorro. I remember I had hot dad. I had a couple of the ones I don't remember, I don't remember.

Armony Mangin: 25:51

But I was clear since the beginning, like it was just fun, but this is not what I was looking for. But I was allowing myself also just to enjoy. It didn't have to be so serious and like go for the relationship, because I was in a place where I knew I didn't need a relationship. I was in my life, I had worked on myself, but I knew I wanted one. So I was like I'm here, show me who you are, I'm going to show you and let's see if it works out. But yeah, I was not like yeah, I just. But also when I went into the app. So it's like it's going to be fun, it's going to be an opportunity to get to know myself on a deeper level and like apply all the things I've learned about me and all the things I want to work on, whether it's just a fabulous opportunity and I'm not going to use it against myself and I'm not going to make it mean anything about me and my worse. So that was. I think that's the core.

Sade Curry: 26:45

Yeah, it didn't make it mean. I love that it didn't make it mean anything about my work, about my loveability. So good, so good. Ok, so you're on the apps, you're having these conversations, you're winnowing people in and out and what happened?

Armony Mangin: 26:58

And then I liked the profile of my current boyfriend hot, dad. But to be honest, he was like after 20 minutes I was tired and he didn't say he had kids, because I told you I usually didn't want someone who had kids. Or maybe I didn't tell you. It was something on my list. It was important for me. I'm not sure it was coming from the right intention and reasons, but for me I wanted someone who had a lot of time for me, because my ex-husband I felt like he didn't have enough time for me and I wanted someone who potentially wanted another kid, a kid, who wanted a kid actually, because I was craving that relationship, that equitable relationship that I didn't have with my ex-husband, and for me a way to do that was to have a kid. And I'm like, yeah, I'm still young, I can have a third kid, I could do that and I want that amazing partner.

Armony Mangin: 27:45

So he didn't say he had kids. He looked really good and actually he lived pretty far from what I wanted. But I was like, okay, let me be a little bit flexible because I want to get this moving, let me like him and then I guess he likes me. On the hinge. You like hurt, hurt, and then you sort of match, and then his first text was about how is it, how is motherhood or parenting because of my? And so then I tell him and I'm like he says, well, I reason, that's a lot. I'm like, oh, do you have kids?

Sade Curry: 28:18

And yes, and then I got that is kind of an unusual opening line.

Armony Mangin: 28:23

Oh well, this is why the men I met, it was all the opening line. One was like Zorro, was like I love young kids and I was like, hmm, should I be worried about that? Yeah, because I could be like very good or like very, you know, like I love young kids. And so now this is all, yeah, and I've met the sweetest guys. To be honest, like I've never met, I haven't met someone who was like he's just, like he was not a fit.

Armony Mangin: 28:51

But for her dad, what really got me intrigued? That? He asked me, I said yes, or maybe I told him I had them half time, 50, 50. And then he said, or maybe I asked him I remember I've got them full time. And I was like in my mind I went into okay, that was funny. I was like he's probably into some sort of like open relationship or polyamorous arrangement. And no, thank you, it's very clear on my profile not even interested. And then once again, that's slower, lower voice, calm. I was like harmony, don't make judgments like this. And so I asked him okay, so are you not fully divorced yet? Or I'm full of unconscious bias because who, what man, what man has full time custody? And he turns out. He said, no, I'm divorced and I have them full time. And then we are in touch for like less than a week, and then he suggests that we meet.

Armony Mangin: 29:53

So every day I come in such in the morning, one at nine, and then he suggests we meet. He was really interesting into life coaching because he's a coach himself. He's a high-hand personal trainer and he's very interesting into quarreling learning and I had sensed that even in his profile that there's a lot of guys on the apps that it seems like they've done so much work on themselves and they're so emotionally intelligent that it seems weird at some point because they're like make such a big deal out of it.

Armony Mangin: 30:21

But his profile was just like enough and I sensed that he had worked a lot on himself and he was going through divorce and he had the kids full time. So I was like very intrigued but that's the reason we really talked about that. But then actually it would be really interesting to have your thoughts on, because what happened and I think I went through actually the opposite of what the common feminist wisdom and all the advice about no one's there is an answer. If he's really into you, he should have followed through, et cetera, because so we agree to meet, we he has to like arrange his kids. He's told me he struggled in the past, in the last month, but now he has a full-time nanny, so everything is getting settled and so he arranges his appointments. He can meet during the day for lunchtime. He's meeting me next to where I work and I live, and the day after, the day before the evening, he takes me through the app.

Armony Mangin: 31:20

He had given me his number but I didn't want to exchange his personal number and he said well, I'm so sorry, my nanny called in sick, so I have to rearrange my whole schedule and I don't have no childcare and it's a mess, but I really wanted me to next week, if you're still up to your mind, of course, like I know what it is, I have kids too. I know what it is. So she's showing, the nanny is not showing up, no worries. And then we text again, and then the day after this is a Friday, we exchange a few things. He tells me everything is gonna do during the weekend. Very clear on transparency. I answer him, and then Silence radio. How do you say in English?

Armony Mangin: 31:56

Radio silence yeah, radio silence. And so he had told me he would contact me on Sunday to plan to meet. And I'm like, oh, I'm also calendaring on Sunday, so perfect. And then I don't get back on Sunday. I remember taking my phone and being okay weird and thinking three things Well, no, actually, no, just weird. Just once again he's not texting me. It's fine Like I was dating someone else and was doing the things that my work, all the things. So I was not attached to that. And then I forget about him for a good two weeks.

Armony Mangin: 32:34

And then someone asked me yeah, someone asked me so how did it go with hot dad? And I'm like, well, it really looked hot on the pictures, but I've never met him so I would never know. And then they asked me why. And then I explained them, and then I go back to my work or whatever I was doing. I was like huh, suddenly I got really curious and I decided I didn't take me long, so there was something about oh.

Armony Mangin: 32:59

And then I heard that nagging voice like no answer is an answer, like it goes to you. I didn't even know I had the name ghosting but like clearly, if it didn't contact you, like why are you doing that? It was pretty agitated and like all the things. And then I had that lower, calmer voice again. I was like Amuni, if you want something different, this is the way you've been thinking your whole life. If you want something different, you're gonna have to do something different.

Armony Mangin: 33:27

And actually I was pretty excited to meet him and he was too. I was like we were saying it's just too bad. And so I texted him. I didn't overthink it, it was very simple. I don't remember because I don't have the text anymore, but it was like and I said something along and I don't remember if it's me or whatever, or maybe we just curious hey, what happened and how are we doing in your kids? I was Easter, what happened? And he didn't take him long to answer. It was like a big apology, like no excuse and, yes, if it was sealed up in the air he would love to meet me. And at that point I was feeling three things. He's a little bit scared because he says I'm no BS, like the way I could be scared the way I am.

Armony Mangin: 34:14

He's totally overwhelmed with the kids full time, his work, a lot of clients, he's an entrepreneur and he's probably dating other women. And so we plan again to meet. And he says again let me check back my schedule and I'm gonna tell you Sunday when we're gonna meet. And on Sunday I'm calendaring. Nobody's calling me or texting me. So I put on my calendar for Monday night after I put the kids in bed, text hot dad. And then that text I'm like hey, what do I say? I suggest we meet online, like we just do a chat, check the vibe, or we meet at the playground with our kids at the park. And if this doesn't work, at least I would have given my best shot.

Sade Curry: 35:07

And then he answers right away.

Armony Mangin: 35:08

He's like now I'm really ashamed and yes, let's do a phone call tomorrow. Then we called for two hours. I remember before I hit the button I was like what the F are you doing? It was so weird someone I didn't know from anywhere Doing a FaceTime call. But then we matched. We connected through our divorce stories.

Armony Mangin: 35:30

And even thanks to the coaching another thing that I got ready to and like the way I was showing it intentionally in that first FaceTime call, I was able to tell him so would you consider having a third kid? Because he also has two kids, two boys, six and four and minus seven and four. And I remember him doing like what? And I'm like, yeah, would you consider having a third kid? And he's like, well, I wouldn't be against it. And then he says a few things and then I see him all relaxed and smile and he said actually, yes, it makes sense.

Armony Mangin: 36:08

Like if I'm finding a partner, of course I want a kid. It's bonding. Yes, I'm honest, I would be open to have a third kid. But these type of questions before I got married and even in my marriage I was never able to show up this way for what was really important to me because I was scared of the answer. But like years after, in like a few months into dating, I was like this is about me and what I want, and let's find someone who wants the same.

Sade Curry: 36:38

Yeah, I love that, yeah, so I was.

Armony Mangin: 36:39

I'm very interesting about your thoughts about who goes to me two times. And then it really came from a clean, curious space. It didn't come from a needy, craspy thing.

Sade Curry: 36:52

Yeah, I was 100% and actually you did exactly what I tell my clients to do. Now I know everyone listening this is like there's a lot of context around this. If you do this and it doesn't work, I'm not giving you this advice in your particular situation because I don't know the context, so just. But I do have clients where they're really interested in someone this guy's like an eight they were planning to meet. He cancels for a reason which sometimes things happen and sometimes things are made up. And so I actually have, and you've been in my seven texts class. It's actually it's the part of my seven texts class that isn't included. It's like that process. So I give about the first seven texts but I actually don't give the rest of the process in that class. The rest of the process is if somebody does cancel on you, my usual suggestion is do a FaceTime. Your car broke down? Okay, no problem, let's do a FaceTime instead. So I actually encourage my clients to use FaceTime to have a lot of gates so that it doesn't always have to be this high stakes, and so you can text. You can text on the app, you can move it to texting on your phone number, you can move it to phone calls, you can move it to video calls even before you get to an in-person date, and so that actually gives a lot of flexibility to verify your intuition. So I have a podcast episode called Training your Reconnecting. Training your, training your Intuition.

Sade Curry: 38:23

I teach my clients to really work with their intuition but not to make assumptions. So there's a difference between your intuition and assumptions. A lot of what floats around in the dating world is something that works for somebody, going by their intuition, that becomes assumptions that other people make. So in your situation you had interacted with him and you had an intuition that he might be right for you. Right, and so what you needed to do was I still wanna talk to this guy. My intuition is telling me there's something here and there are ways to do that doing a FaceTime, doing a phone call. So my clients use phone calls a lot because sometimes they're just not sure about it. They're like, well, I just feel some kind of way, I don't wanna go on a first date with him. I'm like, yeah, don't go on a first date, do a phone call, do a video call, make sure you feel comfortable before you present yourself in person. So I think you did exactly what I would have suggested about you. I would have suggested it on the first time it happened.

Armony Mangin: 39:19

I wouldn't have that in two weeks.

Sade Curry: 39:21

So right after it's like, okay, he says he's letting out. Well, but to be honest, I just forgot about it. To tell you the mind space.

Armony Mangin: 39:27

I was like okay, it works as well. But then someone was like hey, how did it go?

Sade Curry: 39:30

It was like hey, I was really excited about that, so let me check back yes, and we'd rank guys also in my practice and I have guidelines for people to rank a guy. So if a guy's really ranking high, I we talk about making exceptions for those people. But if you guys are six, and it's already conversations already boring, he's already acting weird and then he says his car broke down or whatever. Ah, you know what I'm going to go. You know I give that guy a couple of other chances. But if he's an eight and the connection is there and something happens, then you want to be like okay, I'm not going to rush to un-match that process. So yeah, you and I were on the same page with that one for sure.

Armony Mangin: 40:15

Yeah, well, this is like I really did something that I kind of surprised myself, but I really liked the result.

Sade Curry: 40:22

Yes, yes. So tell us about the result, tell us where you are now. How long have you been together? When did you go exclusive? How did you go through that process of going?

Armony Mangin: 40:32

exclusive. That was something. Actually, I think that was the hardest part to have the conversation, but once again it was an opportunity like to like, show up and do the things and learn and grow actually and grow together. That's a conversation that bonded us and that made us closer. So it's very recent. We've been dating for six months. What happened? Our kids, I got together.

Armony Mangin: 40:57

I've also spent time with him and the kids only without my kids.

Armony Mangin: 41:00

And this was what really unexpected. I thought I would be kind of annoying, pretty quickly annoyed about it, because like, what am I doing here, 50% of my time without the kids, and I'm spending time with him and his kids, and actually it's mind-blowing and it was so much love and I felt that big thing opening up in me because it was being a family again with a man, because I had put this in the back of my mind that you can be another type of family, even though the dad is not in a picture, it's OK, you can be happy. And then I go to meet them and I'm excited. I'm also a little bit crying because I'm like what's going on? And they are there waiting for me in the park and I feel it's my family, like it was meant to be and it's all natural, it's flowing Anyway. So I was just to talk a little bit about them and how I was like I didn't want someone with kids and now I just like I met them and I love them like 100%, like my kids.

Sade Curry: 41:54

Yeah, and that goes to so sometimes like how people say what you really want by coming to package you don't quite expect. This is what it looks like. It's not something you use against yourself to force yourself into a situation you don't want. It's that when you are open to some things being slightly different than what you want, you'll be like oh OK, I didn't realize I wanted these two kids.

Armony Mangin: 42:17

Yeah, and it doesn't have to be hard. It can be like just how can I make it easy for everybody and for us? It's challenging for sure, but it is what it is and I'm taking the whole package but then six months and actually one on vacation after two months and we've never had that conversation like exclusive dating until that point. But it was very clear that he was not seeing anyone because I could see a shift in the communication and like how much we were seeing each other and I was assuming it was clear for me that he wouldn't go on vacation with someone and seeing someone else.

Armony Mangin: 42:54

But we never had the conversation and we started in that beautiful stay in Nicaragua and so he was sending me here to talk, to seeing people a few weeks ago he wouldn't tell me when and I was not surprised, but it was a little bit hard for me to take. And then when we came back and so I saw myself going into all those upset and like what's going on and like this is not what I want, because I felt like he was almost still dating other people. But he was clearly telling me not, but the fact that he did date other people while he was with me. I was like what did you do? So I was seeing myself like that mind who on vacation. I was like don't go there, there's nothing to be fixed now, there's nothing to be decided. You decided you wanted to enjoy this vacation and so we talked about a few things how we feel, what we want, et cetera, and I knew that. But I let it for another conversation.

Armony Mangin: 43:50

And then when we came back, we finally had the conversation and it went pretty well. It was just very bonding. But what I wanted to say is that I got ready for it Like I was trying to lead with love and all the things, because I wanted to make sure it was still not dating anyone, because we still had not said it. And one thing that I learned that I didn't like either is that he told me that he was not seeing anyone, but then I made a comment like you're going to tell me you still like checking your dating profile? He's like well, yeah, well, yeah, actually. And then it goes to all the details. I think I spent about two minutes per day and I just checked and I like, and if someone likes, I send a few messages and what it's like?

Sade Curry: 44:39

well, nothing, I'm like what are you doing it?

Armony Mangin: 44:42

And then I saw myself getting really crazy and I'm like OK, what is the issue there? Yes, it's like the issue that when you're doing that, what I make it mean is that you're not Like I feel like, I'm like. I just say an option, Like in case it doesn't.

Sade Curry: 44:59

Yes, you're an option. You're not the main person. He hasn't shown it to you.

Armony Mangin: 45:02

Yeah, I'm not the main person and you're not putting all your focus and attention in our relationship, when you have your kids, your business, your stuff and you have five minutes to spend every day to do that, I'm like what the hell is going on? And actually explained me that he understand. And so when I say I told him, when you do that, I'm making me like you don't see how amazing I am and you're not spending the time to build our relationship and so I don't feel anything close to respected and safe and secure, which is the basic in a relationship. And then he explained me that he understood exactly. He's a super good listener, Like. He's just like I feel like I have all that space to be myself even more with a judgment. He's going to listen to me, look at me in the eyes and like, wait for me to be done, it's just amazing.

Armony Mangin: 45:54

And then he explains me that I know it was really hard but he's divorced. So it was a lot of so very hard story, lots of betrayal, and he kind of preferred with other relationship and people and he told me he was really honest with that. And so he said this is my way, like he used to be more than I've met you. And then I was like I was also thinking you're not choosing me, like you haven't chosen me. He's like no, I have chosen you. I was dating different people and I chose you intentionally, and so his story is like I chose you.

Sade Curry: 46:25

I was like you didn't choose me and so like working about it, yeah, and I think this is the power of having that conversation where you're clear Like you and I were from the same school of coaching, where we realized that people walk around with different expectations in their minds, and we found the clear conversation that, okay, these are my expectations, that we're exclusive and what this is what it looks like for me, what does it look like for you and do you feel like we're exclusive can really save so much of that heartache of what I was thinking this and I was thinking that and I wasn't sure. That's the power of just. And this is not the only conversation. I'm sure you've had many others, but you see, the ones that are like pivotal and that really cement the relationship if it's meant to be.

Armony Mangin: 47:12

Yeah, and you really have to take just to slow down, take a break, pause it and like, yeah, lead it with like. I remember when, even when I engage into the conversations like I wanna talk to you about something very important for me, and I started with like, and I'm really I've worked so hard on myself to fall in love with myself again not to be in that place and what I'm doing here is really out of love for me, for you and for us and so I went into the conversation like this, this was. I was like you rocked it.

Armony Mangin: 47:42

Like this is what adults do and yeah, and then he let me actually he let me talk throughout. And then there was something else too he was still seeing the other dates that he had told them that it was not interesting. They were kind of looking for polyamorous things. It was like no way. But he wanted to tell them because he kind of ghosted them, because he's starting seeing me and I was like and then, and this was pretty upsetting for me too and so he let me go on a rant. I mean on a rant, a very emotionally regulated one, leading with love. Leading with love.

Sade Curry: 48:15

And it lets me.

Armony Mangin: 48:17

And then he stops and says thank you so much for sharing. And then he smiles just to the little bit. He said the day we had that conversation back like a week ago, I got off of all the apps and I have no intention to keep you as a backup plan and there was no one else I want to be with and I want to be in the relationship with you and we, I see, was a long time partner so that I like I kind of love the heart conversation now because I feel like it's going to be bonding for us.

Armony Mangin: 48:49

It's just like it's getting closer and closer, so it's the heart, and then it just it's an amazing opportunity to connect actually, yeah.

Sade Curry: 48:58

Yeah, oh, my goodness, and I just really want to acknowledge you, because there's something that kind of like a thread that I've seen throughout your journey, even as we wrap up, is that you allowed yourself to be imperfect in this journey. Like I'm listening to you talk about the things that you did that maybe weren't like the most perfect, or how you don't. You're by here, so much acceptance, self-acceptance and so much compassion and just I don't I hear you not judging yourself for the things that maybe weren't exactly what you wanted to do.

Sade Curry: 49:30

So I just really want to acknowledge that that's something I'm hearing in your story that maybe you're not saying quite clearly, but I definitely hear it and I wanted to call it out that, like you have just so much love for yourself and you're not judging yourself for the parts that were not, that were not perfect.

Armony Mangin: 49:47

And that's a practice, that's the work I did on myself, because I can tell you I was so hard on myself, I was so judgmental. I should have, could have, would have all the things, repeating the conversation and the things, but now I'm just like no.

Sade Curry: 50:01

But that's a practice, is that part of the work? And that's why this is when you want to hire a coach.

Armony Mangin: 50:05

This is when you want to hire a study and like, get into, because you need someone to help you see all of that and work on that on a daily practice. Yeah, it's.

Sade Curry: 50:15

Yeah, we do a lot of self-compassion, self-love, inner dialogue, reparenting work. In my fact, it's a huge part. It's a huge part of dating. But please, Armony, thank you so much for sharing your story. This has been so amazing. Could you tell the listeners just kind of give us a recap of like the work that you do as a life coach? Also, you said you're a decision coach. You help women kind of move towards what they want to do on decision at a time. Who typically comes to you and what are some of the things that they achieve or gain when they work with you?

Armony Mangin: 50:52

Well, I thought only one type of person would come to me, but anyone comes to me. But most of these people who are major crossroads in their life could be they want to change career or they want to get that job, or they just decided to have a kid and their single mom, and they have decisions and things they have to figure out and they feel like they're not at a higher potential and they're always like overwhelmed and confused and indecisive. And so what I help them actually is decide what they want, what is their true desire in every aspect of their life, and then, when I have a plan of that, then I know what it is. We practice that desire and translating into actions and what it means for them to get all of that. Because most of the time we kind of know what we want but we're like we're never going to get that. So we put it in the back of our mind and we go in life and as if life was happening to us and we feel very powerless.

Armony Mangin: 51:48

So I help them regain the power in every aspect of their life, one decision at a time. So it's redesigning your life every day and remembering what you want, your values. It's important for you to create the love that you desire, and I based that on my experience. It took me six months to really start feeling a real shift into my mindset, the way I was seeing things, the way I was showing up in the world. So that's why I work with them for six months and we go through all those different aspects, and so what they get is just like, yeah, that kind of self-sense confidence. We work a lot on love for ourselves and have a clear vision from their life in all the aspects relationships, career, friendships, health, money. We work a lot on money, too, because we all have some sort of relationship.

Sade Curry: 52:47

Everybody wants money.

Armony Mangin: 52:50

And anyways, as you do when you coach your clients about dating on the app so dating after 24 and you coach that's what they're going to learn through that they're going to be able to apply it to the entire areas of their life. So one thing you learn there helps for everything.

Sade Curry: 53:07

That's amazing. And where can the listeners connect with you If they want to work with you? They want to connect with you, follow you. Where can they find you online?

Armony Mangin: 53:15

Just my website, www. armonymangincom, and I am on Instagram as a decision coach, armony, but I'm only for now posting sporadically. I'm going to get there. Yeah, absolutely I'm focusing on with the clients.

Sade Curry: 53:33

Exactly and that's really where the work is. So all of Armony's links will be in the show notes listeners, so make sure you follow her on Instagram and you can also go to her website and follow her work. Armony, thank you so much for sharing so vulnerability and just giving so many tips for dating. On the apps, I'm so happy for you and hot dad, and we're going to be stalking your Instagram for pictures.

Armony Mangin: 54:02

So let's see when this stops.

Sade Curry: 54:05

When the time is right and you start sharing. We're going to be here checking it all out, so thank you for being here, thank you so much.

Armony Mangin: 54:13

I just wanted to let all of your audience and listeners just want to tell something which really is important, like, don't let anyone hijack your thinking and you've made your mind with their own fear and insecurity about dating. They will tell you that dating is hard, that they're all good men out there and it's only true if you believe it. And I know it's not the case because I went through that. I went through all the guys' scenarios and I made it happen. It didn't happen to me. I created that with my thinking and thanks to coaching.

Sade Curry: 54:49

All right listeners. We want to thank you so much for your time and attention and we will see you next time. See you soon.